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Dean, our tile consultant, says glass mat backer board is his first choice due to the ease of installation, cost, and because his workers like it. I've never had a failure. This means that even if your waterproofing system leaks, the cement board will remain intact. x 33 ft. Waterproofing Membrane: Kerdi-Board 1/2 in. Schluter says that the Kerdi membrane and tile can be installed over standard gypsum wall board without any problems. We waterproof the outside the hardiboard in 99% of the install with something like redgard. What changes do you suggest to make Bathroom looks more updated? "thanks in advance :-) I know so little about this stuff, but when I watch videos (made by schluter-kerdi) everything looks so tidy and perfect - maybe that's not realistic'''" - Lisa Jasper It should look better than that and it's hard to tell but the wall stud spacing looks extreme and more than 16" I could not see if the screw heads where covered in the photos and in the one picture you can see that the screw and washer fitting where not covered. There are many different types of underlayment to choose from, but they all serve the same purpose. Yup! Kerdi board, on the other hand, is an extruded polystyrene foam panel. Je peux rejeter les cookies non essentiels en cliquant sur Grer mes prfrences . If you want a cement board, use Durock or Wonderboard. Sloped Shower Tray KST1220/1525 - The Home Depot. Any recommendations? Step 4: Place the Tile. Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT is a prefabricated sloped shower tray with integrated Kerdi waterproofing. The main types of cement board you could encounter are Fibre Reinforced Cement (FRC) board and gypsum board. Tile Shower SurroundCement Backerboard Location? Regardless, cement board is a great, trusted tile substrate that will work well on both walls and floors. We like that the Kerdi membrane material installs easily over almost any substrate, including standard wallboard. . Seems like I've been using the full measure of water the bag calls for, plus about 10%.-50 lbs of thinset at a time is too much for an amatuer. Once the wall is prepped, use a primer that is compatible with the KERDI membrane so that it will properly adhere to the wall. builder, anti-builder, rebuilder -- Retired Moderator. How to adhere edge of bullnose tile to drywall as trim for shower/tub surround. It's still applied to cement board. To get the most protection from the cement board, it should be installed in a way that ensures it is waterproof, in addition to being secured properly with the right adhesive and screws. Since my guys and I will be doing this for the first time next week, I 'd like to take advantage of your 'learning curve.' ), Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain, Finite abelian groups with fewer automorphisms than a subgroup. We store towels, medicine, toiletry supplies, first-aid gear, massage devices, facial steamers, spare Painting your garage is a great way to improve the look of the space and make the walls easier to clean. is the contractor creating a waterproof schluter-kerdi shower? This allows for future compression and an area at the corner where things are more forgiving. A complete schluter shower kit is like $700-$900 depending on the size - this includes the pitched foam shower pan. This product is available in 3/16", 3/8", 1/2", 5/8" 3/4", 1" 1-1/2" and 2" thicknesses, allowing for a wide variety of installation options. But that doesn't address your question, so it's just a comment, not an answer as such. To prevent those movements from transferring to the tile floor, consider installing an uncoupling membrane between the concrete and tile surfaces. When it comes to tile underlayment, your options can be categorized into three main classifications, each suitable for different tiling circumstances: Although cement board is the most commonly used underlayment for tile, Kerdi board is growing in popularity as a multifunctional tile substrate. As such, many homeowners and professionals find themselves wondering whether Kerdi Board or cement board is the better tile substrate. Will be doing a bathroom gut and will be laying durock cement board over plywood sub floor. The fastest method [for me and possibly other dilettants] is to stroke the knife at a diagonal to the comb marks, top down, center out, pushing all the air before you with short, overlapping strokes.-Thinset needs to be pretty darn wet: Needs to stay put when combed, but should be soft and shiney. I circled one area, but there are lots of these edges." - Lisa Jasper The Kerdi band should be smooth and flat - not wavy/ "3) there is no membrane of waterproofing on the hardboard across from the "wet wall" after 5 1/2 feet up. When I do another shower I'll use real cement board, not Hardi-board. Kerdi Board panels have a number of other advantages: they can be cut to size using an ordinary utility knife, can be glued or screwed into place, and are very lightweight. Yes, it is recommended to waterproof cement board, especially if it is going to be used in exterior settings or in places where it will be in contact with water. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? I look at ceramic tile as a lifetime-of the house-product, so I use the best material for the job.I prefer to use cement board as the substrate with the Kerdi on top. Additionally, all thin-set should be allowed to cure for 24 hours before tiles are installed. But there are downsides. I like to use a garden sprayer to keep the thirsty Kerdi wet. Kerdi's systems are fairly reputable. What I would be most scared off is the fact that no inside or outside corners appear to have been used. Yes, you should prime drywall before installing KERDI in order to ensure proper adhesion and a successful installation. Portland cement-based unmodified thin-set mortars are dependent on the presence of moisture for hydration in order to gain strength. Now there's nothing particularly wrong with fiber-cementit's just not my first choice. #3 This is a DIY site. On a vertical surface, very little moisture . If a law is new but its interpretation is vague, can the courts directly ask the drafters the intent and official interpretation of their law? If any is found, wait a few more hours and then re-inspect. Once the membrane is in place, it can be sealed and reinforced with Kerdi-Fix sealant, Kerdi band, and Kerdi-Drain for added waterproofing strength. Yes. Waterproofing is an important aspect of any bathroom or wet-area installation. It is important to overlap the edge of the membrane so that it covers slightly more than half of the drywall behind it. I just a few weeks ago put kerdi on top of hardi-board in my shower and it was PAINFUL! You are telling someone "to have" an artistry that not only takes art skills, knowing how to mix mortar for different situations, and a good amount of practice. Waterproofing cement board is relatively simple and there are several different waterproofing products available. ", Signed,Never Hung Kerdi A Day In Her Life. This allows the cement to properly hydrate, resulting in To ensure the floor is clean, wipe it with a wet sponge. I think the first one I used was cheap and that was part of the problem. I posted a plea for help and Mongo and Bill both gave me good advice. We want that inside corner able to move. RedGard can be applied to cement board panels in two ways: Roll it on the wall with a 3/4-inch nap roller or spray it on the wall. It works well, is what Schluter recommends and I've never had an issue with it. First, its super lightweight compared with the rest. Additionally, the drywall should be primed with a latex primer before applying the Kerdi membrane. Our thinset was more watery than the videos, but it still managed to dry out quickly, even in the time it takes to apply the small corners in our shampoo niche. A quality underlayment will also serve as a waterproof barrier between the subfloor and the tile surface. PROBLEM SOLVED for Tub Flange when Installing Cement Board and Tile. Cement board is the most common and widely-known backer board. It could take longer if the space is particularly wet or humid. If you preorder a special airline meal (e.g. This thread is 9 years old and it's the Hardi board that's thirsty not the Kerdi. As a contractor, I have been using Kerdi since it came out. Continuing Education for Architects & Designers. You provide the pitch during the tile set. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Greenboard is the same as regular drywall. In . This will help to ensure that all drywall is completely covered. The shower is ready for tile. Cut the Kerdi membrane to size using a utility knife or scissors. Sledge hammers for the floor, that might take a bit of time. After roughly two days I would fill the corner with silicone. For the floor I make a dry mix mud base and then the Kerdi membrane. If your going to do the job do it right, and give professional advice pls. Kerdi does admit that you can use cement board. It is important to seal any imperfections in the drywall to ensure a long-lasting installation and to minimize water infiltration. Not everyone knows how to do mud and lathe it's so old school plus it wears you out, ive been a setter for 27 yrs and I have yet to go back to one of my showers I installed using perma base or durock, with a liner, i have started using waterproofing such as redguard or aqua-defense. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. Modified thin-set mortars must dry for the polymers to coalesce and form a hard . Will use the Schluter Shower system. see Prop 65 WARNINGS. Step 6: Choosing the Next Tile. It doesn't matter but you absolutely need to use both a substrate and a waterproofing membrane. Backerboard plus a waterproofing membrane like Redgard is all that is needed for tub surrounds with thinset then tile. Welcome to the site. How did this project turn out? Your email address will not be published. Can be cut to size easily using a utility knife. Finally, it is important to remember that any thin-set that has been exposed to moisture must be replaced. Hi.I have a unique situation. Schluter Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT 48 in. First, it's super lightweight compared with the rest. There is no cutting or fitting of boards, and a mortar bed is good for leveling and flattening uneven or out-of-level floors, which are common in old houses. In order to determine which tile underlayment is right for your project, you need to know which issue youre trying to solve whether its preventing subfloor cracks from transferring to the tile, soundproofing, moisture protection, or providing more rigidity to the tile. Foam-core tile backing board has two big advantages over other backer boards. You probably have to go to a big box store's special order desk or find a specialty tile supplier to find it. If so, that means breaking up the floor pan. The taping knife at a low angle makes an enormous difference, and I'm very grateful for that hint. Drywall under Kerdi would have been a better choice. I would fear leaks in all corners of this shower. #2. However, if installed on drywall, it only protects one side. If you can avoid that, the demo would be ~easy enough to maybe have some friends who'd work for beer come over and help you knock it out. When cleaning thinset off of Schluter membranes, the manufacturer recommends using a wet sponge and taking care to avoid any scoring or inconsistencies on the surface of the membrane. Cement board comes both in 1/4-inch-thick and 1/2-inch-thick versions. On the downside, the cement boards are heavy, somewhat difficult to cut and can leave abrasive sandy crumbs that can damage tubs and shower bases if youre not careful. rev2023.3.3.43278. I would avoid Hardi, as Avanti is right that it is thirsty. the cost of the tile job. What's the difference between a power rail and a signal line? To properly seal a cement board for a shower, its important to first properly prepare the surface. Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. Once the adhesive has been applied and has had time to properly cure, then the KERDI membrane can be applied to the wall. Putting this stuff on walls is difficult and time . The most important thing to remember when applying the membrane over the cement board is to make sure the surface is clean and free of any debris, dust or other contaminants. Following the correct application of Kerdi membrane over cement board will ensure a successful waterproofing installation and lasting results for your tile project. Step 1: Measure the area. The cement board core itself is not waterproof, but it can withstand water without falling apart. Ditra is a 1/8-inch thick polyethylene membrane with a layer of anchoring fleece on the underside and a grid of square cavities on top. Actually if you watch any pros work (not on crappy shows) on TV you will see them use backer board 99% of the time. You peeled it off? Your air bubbles will travel along the valleys you've made, and it's way better if you only have to move them 20 inches to the nearest edge rather than all the way from the ceiling to the floor [Again, Mongo can, but he has mad skills].-Not paying attention to the principle of bedding top down, center out. Plus, most self-leveling formulas harden very fast, so you have to plan carefully so you can mix and pour quickly. And second, since it's foam, the board is super easy to cut with just a utility knife. When installing KERDI with . The curb doesn't have to be any wider than a 2x4. When installed, Kerdi Board creates a substrate that is level, flat, square, plumb, and dimensionally stable. We think it is the cement board (Durock) sucking the moisture out of the unmodified thinset. Is a PhD visitor considered as a visiting scholar? If you can paint a wall, you can use RedGard. The site is called floorelf.com. I would get someone else. Cement board, Wedi board, Kerdi board, Hardibacker, Densshield, Durock, Permabase, or Wonder board . @JimmyFix-it - You are right. Self-leveling underlayment has many of the same advantages as a dry-pack mortar bed but doesnt require as much skill to install. True cement board (Durck, Wonderboard) is my first choice as a tile or Kerdi backer. The completed assembly takes the place of more traditional backer board when installed over 3/4-inch wood subfloors. New England. is that because water doesn't really hit that area?" - Lisa Jasper That's pushing it but should be fine. DensShield is one common brand. By the time you switch from the RG application to the Kerdi installation, it should be dry. Shouldn't take too long, maybe an hour or so. Yes, KERDI membrane will stick to cement board. Should I use Kerdi membrane or cement backerboard? Why is there a voltage on my HDMI and coaxial cables? I used this to seal a 3 1/2 by 6 1/2 foot shower with 7 foot walls. Additionally, if the cement board isnt waterproof, it can also cause mold and mildew issues, as well as dry wall damage from the moisture seeping through. The great thing about Kerdi Board is that it is lightweight and easier to maneuver. Ready to join the 100,000+ homeowners matched with pros? BTW the older Kerdi thread referencedwas excellent. The 1/4-inch-thick board is typically used on floors and countertops. Once you have selected the right sealer, follow the manufacturers instructions and apply a generous, even coat over the entire surface of the Hardie board. When it comes to selecting thinset for cement board, there are a few important factors to consider. In normal residential use I wouldn't worry about it. Furthermore, if another trade, such as the shower glass installers, makes a mistake then you'll be . The Ditra uncoupling design is lightweight, durable, and minimizes the possibility of cracked tile and grout. Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? Been clankin' away at this computer for a couple of hours now, guys. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. Install the Schluter Kerdi membrane over the backer board using the correct mortar. When applying thin-set mortar, the manufacturers instructions should be followed closely. It may take more than 1 beer:). And second, since its foam, the board is super easy to cut with just a utility knife. ), Schluter SET, ALL-SET, FAST-SET or an unmodified thin-set mortar is recommended. Spacers are the next step. Then you can apply a thin layer of KERDI-FIX to the board, the membrane over top, and use a rolling pin to press it down and ensure a secure bond. It looks like you have Kerdi installed on the floor and not Kerdi Board. GoBoard is a kind of backer board because the main elements of a backer board are cement, silica, fiberglass, etc. Underlayment is designed to smooth out uneven areas of the subfloor and form a rigid layer that prevents the flooring from bending. ! Additionally, it is important to waterproof cement board before tiling, as the grout and tiles can help keep the board watertight. When installing Schluter Kerdi Membrane over cement backerboard: Should I use Alkali Resistant Mesh Tape and thinset on the seams of the backer board (for long term durability to prevent each board moving independently thus preventing cracking) prior to installing the Kerdi membrane. He would take his rough opening measurement and subtract the thicknesses of the tile, the cement board, and in his unique install method the purpleboard. This is the traditional tile backer. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? After priming, use an approved adhesive to adhere the KERDI membrane to the drywall, making sure the edges are well sealed and joints are tight.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4','ezslot_12',156,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4-0'); A successful installation of KERDI requires well-prepared surfaces and a proper application, so take the time to properly prime the drywall before installation. Also are you saying that you wet ("booking the Kerdi") the Kerdi, as well? #1 - Backer board has nothing to do with HD or any other big box. The back side of the drywall fails and it is just as bad or worse than if it had an issue on the tile side. Waterproof showers are the trend today, so RedGard is an excellent alternative to cement boards that act as vapor barriers. Do the prefab Schluter niches like the double unit 12 by 28shelf have a built in pitch to the bottom and middle shelves to drainoff water as shown in niche that you built in that thread? Cement board is particularly vulnerable to water damage, so waterproofing can help protect it and help it last longer.